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Gonna get down voted, please weigh in JC as well.

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    @Quinn_Williams Giving my opinions on Gamecocks message boards since 2002.

  • BCMCock05

    eddy said... (original post)

    but heard his dad is pushing Bama, Cal or Clemson

    Any idea why that is?

    Maybe it will work out like the last kid they went against Cal for. If he won't come here, out of the SEC and not CU would be great.

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  • Oh and Spurriers goal was to get the best players in SC...he has done that and it shows

  • What baffles my mind is how in the world your staff sells mediocrity so well. Sub .500 record, and yet you somehow pull the top tier kids out of Florida? Just doesn't make sense. Its not even jealousy...its highly unlikely situations like Tony Steward. Kid was FSU all his life...his late father was FSU and wanted Tony there. But yet, he decided to surprise everyone at his school and his own mother on signing day because Dabo dared him to be his own man and stand up for Clemson? Sorry, I just don't buy that.

    You pull the top recruit out of Arkansas this cycle when the home team is just coming off of a Sugar Bowl appearance and a double-digit win season. Maybe Oklahoma, Alabama, or Texas does that....but Clemson?? The same team that was 4-4 in the ACC and lost to USF in the car care bowl?? Again, maybe this makes sense for an in-state recruit that loves Clemson...but a top-tier kid from Arkansas??

    I'm sorry...I just can not buy that you simply have a staff that puts an emphasis on recruiting that follows all the rules. Unless they can really sale the whipped cream on top of a shit sundae.

    Bellamy bathing in thousands of dollars certainly doesn't help your case either...

  • eddy

    cocky4now said... (original post)

    I agree with you on some of your thoughts. Clemson ..as well as most of our competition...does put much more effort into recruiting. I don't think that is a revelation.

    Some of the stuff Dabo and co. do is beyond just hard nosed recruiting. Beleieve it or not...the better coaching staff you are..the less of that questionable stuff needs to be done. Cheating is the way lesser men level the playing field.

    If you can live with having your University being represented by a slimeball..then it doesn't bother me. However, I will laugh at you when things bite Clemson in the behind.

    As for USC...we are doing our own thing. We are trying to build something..without compromising our integrity while doing it.

    That's hogwash. Our guys recruit real hard, they just don't go around praying with kids and paying off recruits brothers at applebees in florida.

    Our coaches' approach is different. Doesn't mean they don't work as hard as others.

  • BritBrant

  • WoodrowST13733 said... (original post)

    Adams? You mean the 3 star turned Top 10 NFL pick?

    Davis was ranked about the same as that fast kid yall got from Florida who was a RB....Sapp was comparable to Matthews. We can go down the list if you'd like.

    I don't think Dabo is in good company...I NEVER SAID HE WAS....

    But to be rational....you can't come on and make fun of Clemson's horrible clock management, coaching, player development....and then just call someone a cheater or cheaters bc they recruit well.

    THATS HOW HE GOT THE JOB.

    No Cord experience....no HC experience...and the guy gets a Top 30 CFB coaching job.....because he's a good recruiter.

    So don't be shocked when Clemson is in the top 7 for player x....and also don't be shocked when we spike it on 4th down, or whatever random moronic thing we do.

    Top 30 job on the country? There's that orange kool-aid again.

    You have at best the 3rd most desirable job in your conference. A conference inferior in prestige to the SEC, Big 10, Big 12, and possibly the Pac 10. I'm sure I could pick a few, maybe 30 jobs from those conferences that are more desirable than Clemson. That doesn't even include Notre Dame.

    If you want to sacrifice February headlines for poor football in the fall, have fun with that. Sounds like the Dabo Swinney era in a nutshell.

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    @Quinn_Williams Giving my opinions on Gamecocks message boards since 2002.

  • Bax

    WoodrowST13733 said... (original post)

    Adams? You mean the 3 star turned Top 10 NFL pick?

    Davis was ranked about the same as that fast kid yall got from Florida who was a RB....Sapp was comparable to Matthews. We can go down the list if you'd like.

    I don't think Dabo is in good company...I NEVER SAID HE WAS....

    But to be rational....you can't come on and make fun of Clemson's horrible clock management, coaching, player development....and then just call someone a cheater or cheaters bc they recruit well.

    THATS HOW HE GOT THE JOB.

    No Cord experience....no HC experience...and the guy gets a Top 30 CFB coaching job.....because he's a good recruiter.

    So don't be shocked when Clemson is in the top 7 for player x....and also don't be shocked when we spike it on 4th down, or whatever random moronic thing we do.

    They aren't developed for the next level. You have a great hype machine. Thunder and lightning. Should I say more?

    Dabo is the second snake oil salesman, just north of the job Tommy, the lip quiver, did before him.

    Gamecocks in the SEC era do better in the professional ranks than Clemson players. It's not even close. Compare all you want.

    BTW, I do respect your posts. You just need to be converted. Unfortunately, trying to convert you is as futile as a hot girl trying to turn a gay guy straight.

    Thank you for the healthy debate.

    This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by Bax 3 years ago

  • Its all about the $$$ and the promises of early playing time up there, its so obvious. From Bowden to Dabo. If it wasn't midnight, I'd really expound on my thoughts. I shouldn't even waste time dealing with Clemson, but sometimes they get a brother riled up!

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    @Quinn_Williams Giving my opinions on Gamecocks message boards since 2002.

  • richcock1

    WoodrowST13733 said... (original post)

    What hypocricy?

    You know Dabo called me when my dad died? He tried to pray with me on the phone.... You know he took the team to Bower's dad's visitation or funeral? You know he's in church every Sunday?

    Sure he let's parents...recruits know he's a church goer...no doubt. I am too...and multiple times a week I act like a complete moron/ass hole and regret a ton of things I say or do.

    I just don't know how he is a hypocrite.

    I think he's a douche...and he aggrivates me with a lot of the things he says and does, but I'm not sure he's a hypocrite.

    Being in church on Sunday doesn't make him a Christian. Just like standing in my garage doesn't make me a car. And, I hope you continue to enjoy the meltdown on your board each November.

  • WoodrowST13733 said... (original post)

    Read so many post on here about Clemson cheating....buying players. No doubt that should be expected on a Gamecock message board. But after long day, horrible golf game, and so-so start to the sales quarter...I'm gonna respond.

    1. Clemson might cheat their asses off...I don't know, but if we did....we'd cheat instate too. Clemson turns USC in countless times a year and vice versa. They go into a file and when a team gets investigated....investigator digs up all that dirt and looks into each email, inquiry from different schools ect.

    2. Dabo Swinney is an incredible salesman. He takes pride in it. He's made his name in coaching as a incredible recruiter. He lives and breathes it. He hired guys like Dan Brooks, Harbinson, Jeff Scott...that are great recruiters as well. Sure we screw up clock management...had a horrible scheme, might not "develop" our players...but nobody can doubt how well or how much effort our HC and other coaches put forth in recruiting.

    I don't think Spurrier lives and breathes it like a Saban, Bobby Bowden once did, or Ron Zook. He's just not that way, and I think that can filter down. Just look at him missing in homes ect last season. Just not a priority for him, and I think that can filter down the staff. Yall have an awesome staff...but I'd say recruiting is Clemson's strength...and I'd say recruiting is an area of development for yalls staff.

    3. How many out of state players have yall gotten that the big boys really wanted? Culliver? Did yall hire his coach as a GA? Know that was rumor....but have yall beaten out The Bama's, Gators, Noles...ect? No doubt yall've done great in state. Clowney, Gilmore, Holloman, Jeffrey, all incredible talents that could start anywhere. So why so shocked with Goldman doesn't have yall in Top 7? How many true out of state guys officially visit? Come to camp? Is SOS at camp? Have you ever signed an OOS 5 star? All this goes back to the whole making recruiting a priority....Hell, SOS still calls it recruiting season. Well that season is year around...and starts when the kids are Freshman or Sophomore's in HS.

    4. Can't tell you the number of thread's I've seen on here about..."Clemson now high bidder for Clowney", "Clemson paying Lexington HC", "Clemson paid for Parker at Beaufort". So were these true? Anyone can make up something on a message board, and for some reason it becomes fact because some random guy types it out on a message board.

    5. When is the last time we won a heads up recruiting battle vs yall? Suprisingly...we don't have many...but I'd say the following were battles....

    Gilmore Holloman Clowney? Parker LB Dukes Dukes buddy Shaq Roland?

    We are under the Mendoza line the last couple of years in true head to head IYAM.

    I can promise you...if we are cheating...we could care less if it's done in state vs out of state. You don't think FSU, Miami, UF, UGA, Arky, UNC aren't major pissed when a 7 loss team comes in and pulls a kid out they've invested 2 or 3 years in recruiting?

    6. Clemson does an awesome job getting kids to come to camp...pretty sure Bellamy, Watkins, Stewart, other LB, 5 star safety who went to LSU, kid from Arky, all came to Clemson's camp as juniors or so. 3 days on a college campus is big. And they get treated like kings.

    Overall...every program is different...Auburn, Clemson, UF under Zook, Butch Davis at UNC, Richt at UGA, Brown at Texas, Brown at UNC, Carrol at USC, my boy at LSU....all believe recruiting is the life blood. They live it, breath it...and work amazingly hard at it.

    I view yall more like Chip Kelly at Oregon, Petrino at Arky, Obrien at NCSU, Paul Johnson at GT, Mike Leach at TT...no doubt yall recruit very well, but IMO yalls staff believes solid scheme, player development is both more of a priority than recruiting. Remember the "He'll take his and beat yours" and take yours and beat his"?

    This is a recruiting website at heart...so you wanna see the Bullard's, or Goldman's become Gamecocks and they might....but just know that I'm sure Gator fans used to get pissed when FSU had all that talent as well when Spurrier was there.

    Always appreciate reading a reasonable Clemson fan. I will give you that until maybe the last year or two, I don't feel Spurrier had been as serious as he should have been about recruiting. I think now we've made that commitment to recruiting year-round and it has showed in that we have a legitmate chance of getting visits from several top ten recruits.

    signature image signature image signature image

    #3peat

  • in essence you say:
    - you recruit good out of state
    - we recruit good in state
    - we got the #1 recruit in the nation only because he was in Rock Hill
    - you got 2 5*s because you recruit with Jesus
    - your coach is an idiot... a Christian idiot, though
    - our coach is a better coach, but rather play golf than recruit
    - you spike on 4th,
    - we beat the #1 team in the nation

    ok, think I got it... you're right!

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  • eddy said... (original post)

    That's hogwash. Our guys recruit real hard, they just don't go around praying with kids and paying off recruits brothers at applebees in florida.

    Our coaches' approach is different. Doesn't mean they don't work as hard as others.

    Tell me that when Lawing actually recruits somebody..without an assist from one of the other coaches...or jr. makes an impact in the lowcountry.

    We have a few guys that pull the load for everybody else.

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  • WoodrowST13733 said... (original post)

    THATS HOW HE GOT THE JOB.

    No Cord experience....no HC experience...and the guy gets a Top 30 CFB coaching job.....because he's a good recruiter.

    And therein lies the problem. Your ad made a questionable (at best) hire based on recruiting and add in the fact he beat Carolina as an interim coach. That one win, I'll argue, sealed your fate. If he loses to Carolina with the interim tag, he doesn't get the job. Look at Tommy Bowden. The ONLY reason he lasted as long as he did was his record against Carolina. You cannot argue it's because of success in the acc. He won no championships and no divisions. Now that we have passed you as a football program, Dabo will not survive with only recruiting, he'll have to win and if he doesn't win y'all's super bowl, which is us, he'll be gone and clemson will be back to square one again. He's already the first head coach at clemson to have a losing season in well over a decade and the first head coach at clemson to lose 2 consecutive to us in 40 years, but boy howdy can he recruit.

  • The easy answer? When well-connected people such as AllenWilliams, Cockfather, and even a member who was recently promoted to the site staff a couple of weeks ago all claim the same thing... well, you get the picture. These are posters with proven track records as far as information goes.

    My personal opinion? I do think Clemson is cheating. I have some of my own personal info to go by in that regard. With that said, it's all moot point for two reasons in my eyes:

    1) The chances of Clemson getting caught are slim-to-none.
    2) Until Clemson cleans house from the top, the talent accumulated won't amount to any Championships.

    The stuff with Clemson's recruiting irked me for a while, but I find more satisfaction knowing that not only have we better than them now, but we will probably be better than them for years to come barring a collapse. Coming from someone that hates the school upstate with every fiber of my being... I absolutely love it.

  • SCarcock

    I have started many threads about this topic but it is like beating my head against a brick wall. Even if Clemson cheats, SO WHAT. Bama cheats, so does Auburn, Florida, FSU etc. If you don't want to compete against that than let's join Big East and suck ass again. This is big boy football so don't whine when we get beat on players. Eddie Goldman is just an example but can you blame him if we aren't in his top 7? He's from DC, not Rock Hill. Cmon guys be happy with what we have. A superior roster, coaching staff, conference, path to the NC game and head to head record recently vs Clemson.
    Crying "cheater" is what 8 year olds do when they lose at a sport.

  • cocky4now said... (original post)

    Tell me that when Lawing actually recruits somebody..without an assist from one of the other coaches...or jr. makes an impact in the lowcountry.

    We have a few guys that pull the load for everybody else.

    I don't see why an area recruiter can't get an assist from the prospect's position coach, or even the head coach. You single out Lawing and SOS Jr., but those two coach the deepest positions on the entire team. They must be doing something right. Sorry, I'll take SOS Jr. over Dabo any day of the week.

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    @Quinn_Williams Giving my opinions on Gamecocks message boards since 2002.

  • MistaQ said... (original post)

    Top 30 job on the country? There's that orange kool-aid again.

    You have at best the 3rd most desirable job in your conference. A conference inferior in prestige to the SEC, Big 10, Big 12, and possibly the Pac 10. I'm sure I could pick a few, maybe 30 jobs from those conferences that are more desirable than Clemson. That doesn't even include Notre Dame.

    If you want to sacrifice February headlines for poor football in the fall, have fun with that. Sounds like the Dabo Swinney era in a nutshell.

    What 30 jobs are more desirable than Clemson?

    Linked list below that have us 11th, 18th, and 22nd. Sure it's opinion, but you act like we are Utah St.

    http://www.collegefootballcafeteria.com/analysis/top-25-coaching-jobs/

    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/554716-the-top-50-coaching-jobs-in-college-football#/articles/554716-the-top-50-coaching-jobs-in-college-football/page/48

    http://www.athlonsports.com/college-football/jobs

  • WoodrowST13733 said... (original post)

    I have started many threads about this topic but it is like beating my head against a brick wall. Even if Clemson cheats, SO WHAT. Bama cheats, so does Auburn, Florida, FSU etc. If you don't want to compete against that than let's join Big East and suck ass again. This is big boy football so don't whine when we get beat on players. Eddie Goldman is just an example but can you blame him if we aren't in his top 7? He's from DC, not Rock Hill. Cmon guys be happy with what we have. A superior roster, coaching staff, conference, path to the NC game and head to head record recently vs Clemson. Crying "cheater" is what 8 year olds do when they lose at a sport.

    I think that the majority agree with your take for the most part.

    I'm not sure if crying "cheater applies when its obvious whats going on.

    I hope that you wouldn't seriously want to be a bagman for USC. Why stoop to the level of the Auburns and UNCs of the world?

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    @Quinn_Williams Giving my opinions on Gamecocks message boards since 2002.

  • TD4SC1 said... (original post)

    And therein lies the problem. Your ad made a questionable (at best) hire based on recruiting and add in the fact he beat Carolina as an interim coach. That one win, I'll argue, sealed your fate. If he loses to Carolina with the interim tag, he doesn't get the job. Look at Tommy Bowden. The ONLY reason he lasted as long as he did was his record against Carolina. You cannot argue it's because of success in the acc. He won no championships and no divisions. Now that we have passed you as a football program, Dabo will not survive with only recruiting, he'll have to win and if he doesn't win y'all's super bowl, which is us, he'll be gone and clemson will be back to square one again. He's already the first head coach at clemson to have a losing season in well over a decade and the first head coach at clemson to lose 2 consecutive to us in 40 years, but boy howdy can he recruit.

    I didn't say Clemson didn't have a problem. I didn't say we did make a good hire...I'm not happy with him as our HC.

    But like I said...don't be shocked when we on a list of some player I've never heard of.

    Sorry if you didn't get point of my entire post.

  • MistaQ said... (original post)

    Top 30 job on the country? There's that orange kool-aid again.

    You have at best the 3rd most desirable job in your conference. A conference inferior in prestige to the SEC, Big 10, Big 12, and possibly the Pac 10. I'm sure I could pick a few, maybe 30 jobs from those conferences that are more desirable than Clemson. That doesn't even include Notre Dame.

    If you want to sacrifice February headlines for poor football in the fall, have fun with that. Sounds like the Dabo Swinney era in a nutshell.

    I just don't see how you don't get it....

    I don't defend Clemson in every way just bc I am a fan. I say negatives with positives.

    Why are you mixing my words? Did I say I printed up t-shirts that say Febuary Recruting Champs? Did I say I like the fact we seem poorly coached?

    No...but I did say we are good at recruiting...that's it. That's the only think that I can say Clemson's staff is good at. Recruiting.

  • SCarcock

    I think that the majority agree with your take for the most part.
    ++++++++++++++++++
    Not from reading the posts on this board. Most think that Clemson is the center of hell and anyone who cheers for them is a lost soul and their head coach is Satan.

    I hope that you wouldn't seriously want to be a bagman for USC. Why stoop to the level of the Auburns and UNCs of the world?
    +++++++++++++++++++
    That post was obviously sarcastic. I dont' want to be a bagman, although one day hopefully I will have enough money to fill the bag.
    I would LOVE to stoop to the level of Auburn and win a NC. Sorry but that's the truth.

  • Kas0988 said... (original post)

    The easy answer? When well-connected people such as AllenWilliams, Cockfather, and even a member who was recently promoted to the site staff a couple of weeks ago all claim the same thing... well, you get the picture. These are posters with proven track records as far as information goes.

    My personal opinion? I do think Clemson is cheating. I have some of my own personal info to go by in that regard. With that said, it's all moot point for two reasons in my eyes:

    1) The chances of Clemson getting caught are slim-to-none. 2) Until Clemson cleans house from the top, the talent accumulated won't amount to any Championships.

    The stuff with Clemson's recruiting irked me for a while, but I find more satisfaction knowing that not only have we better than them now, but we will probably be better than them for years to come barring a collapse. Coming from someone that hates the school upstate with every fiber of my being... I absolutely love it.

    AllenWilliams also said Clemson was the high bidder for Clowney....and that Holloman was soft, not a "true rock hill boy", and overrated.

    Baker said Clemson was "HIS RIVAL" and he didn't care what people said about him, he would do whatever or say whatever to bring down "his rival". Think he said he hated them as well to top it off....

  • WoodrowST13733 said... (original post)

    Read so many post on here about Clemson cheating....buying players. No doubt that should be expected on a Gamecock message board. But after long day, horrible golf game, and so-so start to the sales quarter...I'm gonna respond.

    1. Clemson might cheat their asses off...I don't know, but if we did....we'd cheat instate too. Clemson turns USC in countless times a year and vice versa. They go into a file and when a team gets investigated....investigator digs up all that dirt and looks into each email, inquiry from different schools ect.

    2. Dabo Swinney is an incredible salesman. He takes pride in it. He's made his name in coaching as a incredible recruiter. He lives and breathes it. He hired guys like Dan Brooks, Harbinson, Jeff Scott...that are great recruiters as well. Sure we screw up clock management...had a horrible scheme, might not "develop" our players...but nobody can doubt how well or how much effort our HC and other coaches put forth in recruiting.

    I don't think Spurrier lives and breathes it like a Saban, Bobby Bowden once did, or Ron Zook. He's just not that way, and I think that can filter down. Just look at him missing in homes ect last season. Just not a priority for him, and I think that can filter down the staff. Yall have an awesome staff...but I'd say recruiting is Clemson's strength...and I'd say recruiting is an area of development for yalls staff.

    3. How many out of state players have yall gotten that the big boys really wanted? Culliver? Did yall hire his coach as a GA? Know that was rumor....but have yall beaten out The Bama's, Gators, Noles...ect? No doubt yall've done great in state. Clowney, Gilmore, Holloman, Jeffrey, all incredible talents that could start anywhere. So why so shocked with Goldman doesn't have yall in Top 7? How many true out of state guys officially visit? Come to camp? Is SOS at camp? Have you ever signed an OOS 5 star? All this goes back to the whole making recruiting a priority....Hell, SOS still calls it recruiting season. Well that season is year around...and starts when the kids are Freshman or Sophomore's in HS.

    4. Can't tell you the number of thread's I've seen on here about..."Clemson now high bidder for Clowney", "Clemson paying Lexington HC", "Clemson paid for Parker at Beaufort". So were these true? Anyone can make up something on a message board, and for some reason it becomes fact because some random guy types it out on a message board.

    5. When is the last time we won a heads up recruiting battle vs yall? Suprisingly...we don't have many...but I'd say the following were battles....

    Gilmore Holloman Clowney? Parker LB Dukes Dukes buddy Shaq Roland?

    We are under the Mendoza line the last couple of years in true head to head IYAM.

    I can promise you...if we are cheating...we could care less if it's done in state vs out of state. You don't think FSU, Miami, UF, UGA, Arky, UNC aren't major pissed when a 7 loss team comes in and pulls a kid out they've invested 2 or 3 years in recruiting?

    6. Clemson does an awesome job getting kids to come to camp...pretty sure Bellamy, Watkins, Stewart, other LB, 5 star safety who went to LSU, kid from Arky, all came to Clemson's camp as juniors or so. 3 days on a college campus is big. And they get treated like kings.

    Overall...every program is different...Auburn, Clemson, UF under Zook, Butch Davis at UNC, Richt at UGA, Brown at Texas, Brown at UNC, Carrol at USC, my boy at LSU....all believe recruiting is the life blood. They live it, breath it...and work amazingly hard at it.

    I view yall more like Chip Kelly at Oregon, Petrino at Arky, Obrien at NCSU, Paul Johnson at GT, Mike Leach at TT...no doubt yall recruit very well, but IMO yalls staff believes solid scheme, player development is both more of a priority than recruiting. Remember the "He'll take his and beat yours" and take yours and beat his"?

    This is a recruiting website at heart...so you wanna see the Bullard's, or Goldman's become Gamecocks and they might....but just know that I'm sure Gator fans used to get pissed when FSU had all that talent as well when Spurrier was there.

    Don't really care if ya'll are cheating...not a single bit.It hasn't gotten you anywhere since 1981. Swinney is a great salesperson, but it's kinda' like getting a new job cause you knew someone that worked there. After 90 days you better produce or you ain't gonna have a job.You gotta know something.Flash forward to this year.... and if Dabo wins less than 8 games he is toast...fine'...done! I don't doubt that Clemson recruits well the last year or so, but it is all for naught if you can't develop the players, just a huge waste of money, talent, and time.If you get the kids to camp, sure you have a better chance of signing them....but so do we.Spurrier has rarely had to recruit because he hasn't needed to but even SOS realizes that the recruiting game has changed too.We were in the bottom 3rd of the SEC last year in $ spent on the recruiting trail yet we had a top 15 class in the country.Ya' know why? Because we and you can find everything that we need within 4 states and they all border each other..SC, NC, GA, and FLA. We recently have made a push into the NE but that is rare. What HAS happened is that USC has kept the TN,GA,FLA and ALA's from raiding this state recently like in so many years past.There is consistently enough talent within this 4 state area to supply the talent needed to win big so the need to go outside and go head to head with other elite teams is a waste of time, again.To answer your question, yes SOS has been at camp many times over the years cause I saw it myself with my son for 3 years running.Florida was and is a gold mine for recruits and we have both done well there recently and will into the future.
    Sorry that your sales quarter is off to bad start as I am also in sales and also it 's gotta suck you took a day off in the middle of the week to play golf and have a crappy round. Just recruit a little better and you should be able to improve that to 2 days off in the middle of the week in order to play more.biggrin

    This post was edited by Knot Hole Cock 3 years ago