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Well I actually went to the BB Game.......

  • here working on business and two local guys had tickets so I went.......

    I have been a supporter of Hyman waiting until the end of the season to determine what course to take regarding Horn and I have been open to him (Horn) getting one more season.......

    I still believe that Hyman will and should wait for the season to end before announcing what his plans are for Horn but I am no longer of the mind-set that we should give Horn another season and here is why.

    This team overall has not improved at all this season. Players seem to be loss, players are making the same mistakes that they were making back in Oct such as throwing up bad shots without making a single pass or within 15 seconds. Players can't rebound for nothing and I'm sorry but that is the first thing you learn how to do. Horn appears to be doing all that he can during the game to encourage and lead this team but it just isn't working. These guys just don't get it. No matter how you slice that it comes down to coaching. The staff is weak, I'm sorry but I watched the assistants during timeouts and I can't say they did anything. I watched the Vandy staff during halftime and those guys were constantly talking to and pointing out mistakes to their players and what they wanted the player to do. Our staff seems to have mailed it in and you can only correct that one way - get rid of them. If we are going to do that we might as well go ahead and get rid of the guy whose job it was to hire the best staff he could, it was job 1 and he failed at it.

    The final straw for me though was after the game sitting in a bar. There were Vandy fans all around and you would have thought they would be happy. Nope! This lady in her late 50's said it all "If we can't beat SC by more than 10 points as bad as they are, we're in trouble". Guy with her says " Yeah, it isn't like we were playing them in football, they're good in everything but basketball thank God!"

    And they're right. We are a very bad basketball team at a time in our history when we are very good in almost every other sport but basketball. We have to do something and even though he's only been here 4 yrs, a change has to be made, needs to be made not only for our program's future but for Horn's as well. He is a good young man and on a lower level I'm sure his style of play could work but he's overmatched at this level. I am certain that he wants to do better and this has to be killing him inside. So stepping back, getting another shot at a lower level could help him regain his focus and confidence.

    Lastly, I grew up watching John Roche, Kevin Joyce, Brian Winters and those guys shoot the basketball. I would go out into my back yard and practice using their form. NO coach stood there schooling me on techique, I just replayed in my mind what I saw those guys doing. (mainly John Roche) I wasn't much of a basketball player as football and baseball were my game but I made the JV team by being able to shoot jump shots. If I could teach myself to shoot half way decent by watching those guys, why can't our current players learn to shoot jump shots with coaching? Their form is terrible. They throw the ball at the basket, they don't shoot it. I was taught to hit the upper corner of the shooting box on the backboard when doing a lay up. We practiced layups first, every practice. Our guys can't even hit lay ups....how is that possible????

    No when you just sit and watch this team of players you realize there is no way to determine if they have talent or not because they don't have any basic fundamentals. Sorry, boxing out just isn't that hard.

    Call me what you want but at the end of this season I think Hyman must make a move by getting rid of the entire staff and start over. He's a good AD and other than this hire, he's had success hiring people. So accept the mistake and move on. U can't hit a home run on every hire but you sure can correct a bad one when you see it.

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    CockOracle

  • most viewed thread for 2-23-2012.....calling it now....well said

    scottusc03

  • The atmosphere surrounding our coaching staff was described to me as "dead man walking" by a friend who knows them well.

    MCR

  • I think Horn stays and the whole staff goes. I think they will make him bring in an older experienced Head Coach as an Assistant Head Coach and some young recruiting beasts. I think he is going to get a two year extension but the buyouts will decrease dramatically. If he wont agree to that he will probably be let go. Kind of like the scenario Sparky was given...

    87uscfan

  • Curious but how did you watch the Vandy staff at halftime? Did your buddies get you into the locker room too? Or does the weirdness that is the Vandy facility mean that they have no locker rooms and just sit right there on the baseline during halftime too?

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    cockfool

  • I don't know how anyone could expect USC to win that game when the refs called seven fouls on USC for every one they called on Vandy. The FT were 28 to 4.

    Jelsik Sturm

  • Jelsik Sturm said...

    I don't know how anyone could expect USC to win that game when the refs called seven fouls on USC for every one they called on Vandy. The FT were 28 to 4.

    The foul calls don't have anything to do with the rest of what the OP stated. A lot of good points made about the team as a whole. I've been in the minority in that I wanted to give Horn another year, but now I really don't see what this team would gain from that. I will not attack Horn in the way that some posters do and say that he is a pitiful baskeball coach because he's not. I don't think he's laying down on the job or not trying real hard. It just seems that he's not the guy to get the job done here. I think he'd have a great run of success if he went back to the mid major ranks.

    jaydeejazzyjeff

  • cockfool said...

    Curious but how did you watch the Vandy staff at halftime? Did your buddies get you into the locker room too? Or does the weirdness that is the Vandy facility mean that they have no locker rooms and just sit right there on the baseline during halftime too?

    They each go to the corner of the court at halftime. Old school...pretty cool! LOL

    TaylorsCock

  • Jelsik Sturm said...

    I don't know how anyone could expect USC to win that game when the refs called seven fouls on USC for every one they called on Vandy. The FT were 28 to 4.

    Really?? Is that all u got now in your defense of Horn and our pathetic play? Blame it on the refs? Pathetic. Wake up! We are by far and away the worst team in the Conf and it isn't going to get better next year or anytime under Horn.

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    Spur23

  • Jelsik Sturm said...

    I don't know how anyone could expect USC to win that game when the refs called seven fouls on USC for every one they called on Vandy. The FT were 28 to 4.

    I'm sure the same argument was made about us when BJ McKie played here.

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    Hook Williamson

  • cockfool said...

    Curious but how did you watch the Vandy staff at halftime? Did your buddies get you into the locker room too? Or does the weirdness that is the Vandy facility mean that they have no locker rooms and just sit right there on the baseline during halftime too?

    Sorry I meant during time outs....had a little to much to drink lol

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    CockOracle

  • CockOracle said...

    "Lastly, I grew up watching John Roche, Kevin Joyce, Brian Winters and those guys shoot the basketball. I would go out into my back yard and practice using their form. NO coach stood there schooling me on techique, I just replayed in my mind what I saw those guys doing. (mainly John Roche) I wasn't much of a basketball player as football and baseball were my game but I made the JV team by being able to shoot jump shots. If I could teach myself to shoot half way decent by watching those guys, why can't our current players learn to shoot jump shots with coaching? Their form is terrible. They throw the ball at the basket, they don't shoot it. I was taught to hit the upper corner of the shooting box on the backboard when doing a lay up. We practiced layups first, every practice. Our guys can't even hit lay ups....how is that possible????"

    Phil Jackson and Pat Riley must really suck as coaches too since they could never teach Shaq proper form in how to shoot free throws. Guess they should have hired you.

    This post was edited by blessedcock on 2/23/2012 at 7:59 AM

    blessedcock

  • 87uscfan said...

    I think Horn stays and the whole staff goes. I think they will make him bring in an older experienced Head Coach as an Assistant Head Coach and some young recruiting beasts. I think he is going to get a two year extension but the buyouts will decrease dramatically. If he wont agree to that he will probably be let go. Kind of like the scenario Sparky was given...

    What coach worth a damn would take the job as a lead assistant for a coach who is subject to be fired at any time? As a top level assistant you look for job SECURITY, and that is something Darrin Horn simply cannot offer. Why do you think the one good coach he hired got up an left at his first opportunity? Why do you think we had to rehire a guy we demoted to assume that position?

    Horn is done. His future at this program is over, he knows it, the players know it, and recruits know it. Let's just all hope that Eric Hyman sees this reality as well. Horn has already set this program back at least 5 years. If Hyman doesn't fire him and go full bore after Gregg Marshall or some other competent coach, it is evidence that Hyman puts pride before program.

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    Mike Honcho

  • CockOracle said...

    Sorry I meant during time outs....had a little to much to drink lol

    I was genuinely curious. That place is abnormal so like Taylor's said, I wondered if they didn't actually do halftime right there for all to see.

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    cockfool

  • i feel like i am at the mortuary....the corpse is in the casket, nice black & garnet arrangement....its got that funeral home smell we all know. lets make this a wake not a funereal type event. i recall the old guy back in the mcguire days. quite a program he was.

    rip usc hoops

    Aaron Burr Cock

  • jaydeejazzyjeff said...

    The foul calls don't have anything to do with the rest of what the OP stated. A lot of good points made about the team as a whole. I've been in the minority in that I wanted to give Horn another year, but now I really don't see what this team would gain from that. I will not attack Horn in the way that some posters do and say that he is a pitiful baskeball coach because he's not. I don't think he's laying down on the job or not trying real hard. It just seems that he's not the guy to get the job done here. I think he'd have a great run of success if he went back to the mid major ranks.

    What ref drew up a gameplan of launching long jump shots that caused us to shoot 31% from the field? What ref decided to tell our players to shoot threes rather than drive to the hoop and draw fouls? What ref made the decision to sit our best player during a 5 minute stretch when Vandy did not score? Oh wait that wasn't the ref, that was our pitiful basketball coach.

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    Mike Honcho

  • blessedcock said...

    Phil Jackson and Pat Riley must really suck as coaches too since they could never teach Shaq proper form in how to shoot free throws. Guess they should have hired you.

    You can't compare anyone on this team to Shaq. Not even in the same universe. Bad logic here. Yeah Shaq could never shoot a freethrow - but in his prime the man was good for 28-30 and 10 per game and acutally averaged 27 and 11 for a CAREER. We don't have anyone that can sniff that. So yeah - if you don't have that size and ability in the paint then you best be able to shoot FTs...Shaq didn't need to as that wasn't what teams had him for.

    WoCo

  • Jelsik Sturm said...

    I don't know how anyone could expect USC to win that game when the refs called seven fouls on USC for every one they called on Vandy. The FT were 28 to 4.

    It's called being the aggressor. If you constantly settle for outside shots, you're not going to get a lot of fouls called your way. Pretty simple.

    Lexington_USC

  • WoCo said...

    You can't compare anyone on this team to Shaq. Not even in the same universe. Bad logic here. Yeah Shaq could never shoot a freethrow - but in his prime the man was good for 28-30 and 10 per game and acutally averaged 27 and 11 for a CAREER. We don't have anyone that can sniff that. So yeah - if you don't have that size and ability in the paint then you best be able to shoot FTs...Shaq didn't need to as that wasn't what teams had him for.

    You are here...................................................................................................................................the point is over here. Nobody compared Shaq to our current players. But Shaq played his entire career as a late game liability. Teams devised a foul based defensive scheme for him he was so inept at FT's. To say he didn't "need" to shoot FT's is silly. Imagine what his numbers would have been if he could have shot 70% form the stripe?
    The point is that some of the greatest coaches in the history of basketball couldn't teach him to shoot FT's.
    Likewise, it's not Horn's fault ths team can't shoot FT's. There is much you lay at his feet. FT shooting isn't one of them.

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    cockfool

  • WoCo said...

    You can't compare anyone on this team to Shaq. Not even in the same universe. Bad logic here. Yeah Shaq could never shoot a freethrow - but in his prime the man was good for 28-30 and 10 per game and acutally averaged 27 and 11 for a CAREER. We don't have anyone that can sniff that. So yeah - if you don't have that size and ability in the paint then you best be able to shoot FTs...Shaq didn't need to as that wasn't what teams had him for.

    Wasn't comparing anyone to Shaq, merely noting that just b/c you coach someone to do something properly doesn't mean they are capable of doing it. I'm sure Phil, Pat, and a myriad of other coaches taught Shaq proper technique and form, but he wasn't able physically or mentally to carry it out. Perhaps another comparison might be the constant criticism of Roy Williams' team's inability to defend the three on a consistent basis. Do you think Roy doesn't coach them how to defend properly? Or is it possible that his players don't listen or apply what he teaches? Which do you think is the more likely scenario?

    blessedcock

  • blessedcock said...

    Wasn't comparing anyone to Shaq, merely noting that just b/c you coach someone to do something properly doesn't mean they are capable of doing it. I'm sure Phil, Pat, and a myriad of other coaches taught Shaq proper technique and form, but he wasn't able physically or mentally to carry it out. Perhaps another comparison might be the constant criticism of Roy Williams' team's inability to defend the three on a consistent basis. Do you think Roy doesn't coach them how to defend properly? Or is it possible that his players don't listen or apply what he teaches? Which do you think is the more likely scenario?

    Roy's current team shoots in the 60's from the free throw line by the way. They do that with 5 guys that are likely lottery or 1st round NBA picks. Pretty sure it's not a coaching issue.

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    cockfool

  • 87uscfan said...

    I think Horn stays and the whole staff goes. I think they will make him bring in an older experienced Head Coach as an Assistant Head Coach and some young recruiting beasts. I think he is going to get a two year extension but the buyouts will decrease dramatically. If he wont agree to that he will probably be let go. Kind of like the scenario Sparky was given...

    Horn won't be able to hire an older experienced Head Coach as an Assistant. None will come here. He just had that same thing (Early I think his name was) and he jetted as soon as he could.

    Fomerly known as Garnet&BlackAttack.

    GarnetNBlack247

  • cockfool said...

    Roy's current team shoots in the 60's from the free throw line by the way. They do that with 5 guys that are likely lottery or 1st round NBA picks. Pretty sure it's not a coaching issue.

    Maybe cockoracle could take 'em out back and teach them proper form.

    blessedcock

  • The Court Cock's offensive gameplan is simple. Push the ball up the floor and shoot the rock if there is an open look. No coaching involved in the strategy.

    CockedLocked

  • Some of you guys need to lighten up.

    Thanks for the well thought out post and calling out what you see without delving into "Horn sucks". I agree with you and think there's no way around making a change.

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    "I AM trying to be the best at exercising" --AZ, FL, KY, NY-- ** TX 2013**

    GAMCOK